The Happy Engineer Podcast

002: Accelerate Career Results by Reverse Engineering Success with Jeff Baietto

In this episode, learn how to reverse engineer career success for engineers with Jeff Baietto. He is host of the InJoy Success Podcast and COO at InJoy Global, where his Masters in Spiritual Psychology comes in handy creating systems and technology that support rewiring your nervous system.

Jeff experienced the highs of early success, followed by the rock-bottom lows of losing it all. If you have achieved the accolades of what most engineers call success, but you don’t feel successful… this conversation is for you.

If you don’t have any of the accolades, and want more engineering career success… this conversation is for you.


The Happy Engineer Podcast




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I loved this conversation with Jeff Baietto COO and co-founder of InJoy Global. What made this episode so great? Keep reading.

Start by taking action on what you know. It is the things that you know, but that you aren’t doing. That’s holding you back in your career and in your life right now. At OACO action is key. And while we covered a lot of information in this episode, it all goes back to action if you want results.

Do you know that feeling of losing everything you’ve worked so hard to build and gain in your life? It’s a tough one. You feel trapped, like a victim and you don’t have a choice. And in that place of vulnerability and fear, you’re going to discover parts of yourself. And you’re going to learn more about who you are than ever in your life. It’s during one of these life-altering, crisis situations, where you give yourself permission. Permission to look at your life as if for the first time, and to ask yourself new and different questions.

What, if anything were possible, would you go for in life? What would you do if you could not fail?

Start asking yourself better questions. The truth is, few engineers have the discipline and the willingness to sit with these questions and make new decisions. Let alone follow through and take action. So get a coach, get into accountability, get into an environment of support to make that happen.

You want that big paycheck. You want to make an impact with engineering in your life. To leave a legacy of doing something great, reaching your full potential. And believe me, I am absolutely for you to go and create incredible results in your career. But at the end of it all, when you’re on your deathbed, Jeff reminds us you’re not going to say, “I wish I had put in another Saturday, at the office.”

We don’t want comfort. You just think you do. I say this all the time and I can’t say this enough. If you’re experiencing burnout, if you’re experiencing frustration, if you are feeling stuck in your career, maybe things have plateaued. You must be willing to step out of your comfort zone. You must first choose to step out of safety and security, and then do the scary things that stand between you and the career of your dreams.

Everything that you desire to bring into your life is going to be found just outside of your comfort zone.

So enjoy your vacations. Go on great vacations. That’s a necessary part of a balanced and fulfilling life. Absolutely. But don’t be sucked into the lie that going on a vacation is going to somehow change the situation, the patterns and the habits of your own thinking, or your own behaviors that are causing you to feel that way.

And if I had to pick one of the many stereotypes that are out there about engineers, it is that we have very low emotional intelligence. If you were hoping to build the life and the career of your dreams without ever getting in touch with your emotions, or if emotions sound too soft to you, I’m sorry. The truth is you’re a whole person. You’re not just a computer. The quality of your life depends on the quality of your emotions.

I know. As an engineer, you want to focus on your intellect and your capabilities and systems. And listen, those things are all super important, but, as a whole person, in this conversation with Jeff Baietto, we want to coach the whole person. Not just talking about it, not just theory, but how to apply what Jeff shared. So listen to this episode, every last word, and take action. Step out of your comfort zone, and have some fun doing it.





Jeff is the COO and Co-Founder of InJoy Global, Host of the InJoy Success Podcast, and Co-Creator of the revolutionary self-care app – InJoy Daily: The Self-Care Game.

What started decades ago with a childhood passion in discovering the most successful ways to live was materialized almost a decade ago when Jeff co-founded InJoy Global – a company aligned with his personal mission to help as many people as possible live the life of their dreams. As COO he brings a unique combination of skills to the corporate culture-shaping and personal development arena.

Jeff has a Masters in Spiritual Psychology, and a background in the video game industry, along with years of experience in executive coaching and personal development. With this cocktail of gamification and positive psychology, Jeff is on the cutting edge of what makes changing for the better, easier and faster than ever before.

What you’ll find is Jeff’s experience, stories and overall energy will make it clearer than ever that no matter where you are in your life or what change you want to create for yourself… YOU CAN DO IT.





Please note the full transcript is 90-95% accuracy. Reference the podcast audio to confirm exact quotations.

[00:00:00] Zach White: [00:00:00] Welcome everybody glad you’re back. Hey, today I have an incredible privilege to talk with my man, Jeff Baietto, and Jeff and I connected not long ago. He’s the CEO co-founder of InJoy Global and host of the InJoy Success Podcast, which I had the pleasure of being interviewed on. Everybody needs to go check out the podcast. He’s co-creator of the revolutionary self-care app,

[00:00:22] InJoy daily, the self-care game. What started decades ago as a childhood passion for this guy, discovering the most successful ways to live materialized when Jeff co-founded InJoy Global. As a company, totally aligned with his personal mission, to help as many people as possible live the life of their dreams.

Expand to Read Full Transcript

[00:00:42] And if you know, OACO. That right there resonates so much with me and what we’re doing here as COO Jeff brings a unique combination of skills to the corporate culture, shaping professional and personal development arena, a masters in spiritual psychology. I can’t wait to understand more about that, and a background in the video game industry for all our gamers out there, along with years of experience and executive coaching, personal development.

[00:01:07] Gamification positive psychology and on the cutting edge of what makes changing for the better, easier, and faster than ever before. What you’re going to find is the same thing that I’ve found. That’s Jeff’s experience his stories, his energy, his heart, everything. This guy brings is going to make it clearer than ever, no matter where you’re at in your life or what change you want to create for yourself.

[00:01:32] You can do it. Jeff, welcome to the podcast!

[00:01:36] Jeff Baietto: [00:01:36] Thank you, Zach. It’s so great to be here.

[00:01:38] Zach White: [00:01:38] Jeff. There’s so many places we could start and I’m going to go off the beaten trail. I was looking at an old Twitter handle of yours. The Baietto brothers and I saw an amazing photo of a long haired version of Jeff from back in the days where you were working with complete balance.

[00:02:00] Tell me what that was about.

[00:02:03] Jeff Baietto: [00:02:03] The long hair or both the long hair and the complete ballot. Well, I’ll tell you the, the hair is kind of a funny story. So I grew up in a kind of a strict house. I always had short hair, very, very, very tight, you know, it was just, it was proper and well behaved and all those things, but I always dreamed of kind of.

[00:02:21] I mean that, that was my dream of rebellion. Like a little, little, the little inner rock star, not, but, and so, but I never could, like there, it was for sports or for the jobs or whatever the case was. And I was in a position in my life where I was fortunate enough to take several years off as I was getting my master’s and I’m doing a lot of yoga and just traveling.

[00:02:40] And I was like, you know, now or never. And so I let it grow. And , , interestingly I was living in I’m from Wisconsin and Wisconsin long hair kinda means that you’re probably. Not on the right track, but, but, but I, but in LA, everyone thought I was everyone thought I was a musician or they thought I was a writer or creative, like a creative type.

[00:03:01] And it was interesting. And the only thing I’d say about that is everyone immediately thought I was creative. They, they automatically gave that to me. And it was interesting to own that so that I could ultimately cut my hair and keep, keep the fact that I was really able to own this other aspect of myself.

[00:03:18] , well, I was, I was cultivating, but it was not in any way how I knew myself prior to that. So that was one thing from the hair and complete balance. It was my brother is a amazing chiropractor. That was the name of his practice, a complete balance. And so when, when I got into the tech technology side of things, Tech to help people form positive habits.

[00:03:37], we, we joined forces for awhile to help people in their physical wellbeing to make better nutritional choices and, and reduce stress and those kinds of things. So we were doing back in those days you know, a lot of talks and, and then I got, we got. A couple of corporate clients and we did, we did go different ways.

[00:03:54] And so our, this, this side became enjoyed global and he’s become a rock star in the chiropractic.

[00:04:00] Zach White: [00:04:00] I love that long hair was your form of rebellion, Jeff. And I’ll tell you when I was falling into my rebellious state. It was not to follow in my dad’s footsteps of electrical engineering, but to go in the rebellious direction of mechanical engineering, that was my, my big rebellious move.

[00:04:22] So, so when you were doing work with complete balance and blending chiropractic and some coaching, I saw a phrase in here that you helped high achievers to understand this balance between achieving. And fulfillment. And was that the beginning for you of starting down this road of like, Hey, is there more to the story than just achieving everything I want?

[00:04:46] Jeff Baietto: [00:04:46] Yeah. I’m glad I really appreciate you doing the research and find those things. You know, I was in, at that time, I was also in my master’s program. , and while it sounds like a weird degree, like spiritual psychology, it’s like a two year program on using yourself as a Guinea pig in an experiment on creating a life that you really want to be living.

[00:05:02] So we looked at all areas of our lives are our beliefs and what was working, what was not working. And then we deconstructed that a really beautiful, one of the things that I had found was Driven to achieve, but I didn’t feel successful no matter what. I had a great rese. I had done a lot of things.

[00:05:20] I had, you know, again, the accolades of what a lot of people would consider success, but inside I didn’t feel it.

[00:05:26] Zach White: [00:05:26] So hold on. Right. I didn’t feel successful. Like that statement is such an interesting one to make. And I know that the engineer listening to this can relate to it. Through a project or a promotion, or like you’re checking the boxes, but there’s something missing.

[00:05:45] Like, tell me more, like, how did you become aware of that? What was that like to not feel the success?

[00:05:52] Jeff Baietto: [00:05:52] I mean, this is a common story. I think that so many of us have is we think we’re chasing what we want with the idea that that’ll make us happy. That’ll make us feel successful. That it’ll be rewarding.

[00:06:02], and then we get there and then what we tend to do, they call it pushing success over the cognitive horizon. So basically we never get there. We’re, we’re trained to always move. You know, if we hit a goal, we switched the goal. We build this then we got to build that we sell this much. Then we got to sell that much.

[00:06:19] We get the promotion, we need another promotion . So we’re never there in our mind, we’ve set up happiness as a result of success, but we keep moving. We keep moving the yards. So that we never get there. so, so that’s how a lot of us have been programmed and trained to think about achievement and success or achievement and fulfillment.

[00:06:40] So you have to it’s the, the fact is that the brain actually works in the opposite way is if we feel success, if we feel what we want to feel, happiness, contribution, connection, fulfillment love, you know, joy. If we feel those things to do. , then we actually attract in and we actually move with more grace with more with more joy in the direction of whatever the bigger thing is that we’re working on and we’re working towards, but that’s not determining how we feel like we’re bringing that feeling with us.

[00:07:10] And that’s a really powerful gift as hans is that we actually get a chance to choose that , , like irrespective of what’s happening in the room. We can choose our, our experience from a feeling point of view. And that’s a big shift. Like if anyone listened, like if you listen to that, like that’s, it, it feels weird.

[00:07:27] It’s like, no, no, I do this. And then I, and because of that, I get this. But if you do it the other way, if you could feel something first, then, then the rest of it is, you know, is easier to attract is easier to get in the journey as much that much more fun.

[00:07:42] Zach White: [00:07:42] Jeff. That is a huge shift. Yeah. As an engineer, we think a lot of times in systems ways, whether that’s serially a then B, then C or cause and effect, Y equals F of X, you know, you name it.

[00:07:57] And, and you’re asking me to flip the paradigm here rather than achieve a thing and then feel success, feel success first, and then achieve a thing. Where was it in your story that you actually experienced that for the first time? When did that become your reality? Yeah,

[00:08:18] Jeff Baietto: [00:08:18] first for the engineers listening, like this is reverse engineering, real success.

[00:08:23] Like this is literally deconstructing. If you look at people who have, have like the quality of life that you want, and if you deconstruct what they’ve done, it’s. 100% of the time. There are a lot of people with a lot of money who are super unhappy, a lot of people with a lot of a great job title, a lot of success who, you know, are addicted to drugs or they’ve got other issues and they haven’t found it.

[00:08:48] Like they’ve gotten good at one thing. And so this is reverse engineering, real success, right? So for me, this was a long process. I feel like I’m very slow at this cause I was a self-help kid. I heard it a lot, but for me to actually get it. the, the moment was 2008, when the financial crisis hit, I had had a lot of success when I was in my twenties.

[00:09:09] I had saved a lot of money. I had invested in real estate and the story I was telling myself is one I’m successful because of that. And too, as long as, you know, things always go up and as long as everything works, I’m going to be good. ,when the real estate thing happened, I lost, I lost it all. I lost millions of dollars and I was completely.

[00:09:28] Back at zero. And and I was scared like here I was in my thirties, I had always like, my identity was attached to being a successful person. And now I wasn’t that now two things happen there first and nobody that I knew cared, not a single person cared at all that I had property or didn’t have property that I had money in the bank or didn’t have like, so that was interesting because I really thought like, that’s my worth and it wasn’t.

[00:09:52] So that was a really big. Eye-opener everyone who actually means anything to me, doesn’t care at all. If I have money or not, they still like me. They still want me to be a part of their life.

[00:10:00] Zach White: [00:10:00] So the people who loved you before the crash still loved you after the crash,

[00:10:07] Jeff Baietto: [00:10:07] nothing to do with that. Like yeah, that was so that as obvious as that sounds, that was like that jolted me.

[00:10:13] Yeah. And the other thing was I had noticed that my background story was, I don’t want to lose this. Like, I don’t want to lose this. I don’t want to lose. Once I lost it, my eye, the question, then I could ask, I could ask different questions. And so it was now I have, if I had nothing left to lose, what would I actually want to do?

[00:10:32] I had nothing left to lose and I can start to choose what I really wanted to do. And that opened up a whole bunch of different choices that put me on a path to where I am today, which is way more in alignment with who I really am with who I really want to be.

[00:10:50] Zach White: [00:10:50] This is so there’s so many things I want to ask you around this moment, Jeff. And, but I think the one that stands out it’s really important for, you know, the engineer listening around relationships and those people who showed up for you before, during, and after what externally could be described as maybe the biggest failure of your life or the biggest point of crisis, you know, at least at that time, How important were those relationships for you in getting through to the other side of this awareness and asking these, these new questions?

[00:11:25]Jeff Baietto: [00:11:25] you know, it’s hard to put words into how important that is. And what’s really the journey for me has been, as I always said, my relationships were important. I always felt like I told the people that I were in my life, that I cared about them and that they were important, but I didn’t like, again, I didn’t really feel how.

[00:11:45] Until that moment, like then my gratitude for them, my, my appreciation for who they were in my life. Like it just went up by an order of magnitude. And so. One that’s beautiful because at the end of our lives, it’s it’s relationships. Like, that’s it like how, how is my family life? , now I have a son. So how has that relationship?

[00:12:05] My friends, the people like that’s actually, again, to quote the kind of overused thing, no one ever said on their death that I wish I would have spent more time at the office. , so relationships are crucial. , and that was one of those moments where it gets. Wow. You know what I actually felt? And this is going to, again, to your engineering crowd.

[00:12:21] I don’t know if this sounds too weird, but like, I felt actually loved for me because I could make it about something else. Oh, they like me because I’m good over here. I’m this. Or I have this kind of knowledge, but when, when all that went away and I’m like, oh, I’m a failure. I’m really not that smart. I’m not that good.

[00:12:39] And they still liked me. There was something about that that was like, wow, maybe I’m worth, maybe my worth isn’t wrapped up in the. Maybe my worth is something something more

[00:12:52] Zach White: [00:12:52] after that event, Jeff, would you still call yourself an achiever and achievement minded person

[00:12:59] Jeff Baietto: [00:12:59] maybe, but it was always , , wrapped in quality of experience.

[00:13:04] It was, it was a quality achiever. Deep things, but the quality of that experience needed to be way different than what I was before. And it needed to be something I was working on the whole time as I was working towards something, the quality of that had to be good. The thing itself had to be rich in quality.

[00:13:24], and then the result of it, like whatever it was actually going to be, had to be. Something that I valued in terms of quality. Yeah.

[00:13:34] Zach White: [00:13:34] How do you define or understand that quality for yourself? If you’re reflecting on something happening in your life and experience and achievement , , you know, an accomplishment and you’re seeking that quality of the experience, like, what does that mean?

[00:13:49] How do you define that?

[00:13:51] Jeff Baietto: [00:13:51] You know, I, it is, it is something that most of them. No, when we’re, when we’re in alignments. And again, if it, that was the one, one example for in this time period. So I had always like, had, had a bucket list of things that were on my, you know, have to have to do, but I’m afraid of kind of things fears to work through.

[00:14:15] One of them was doing standup comedy. Like, I couldn’t think of anything more terrifying than being on stage and having a bunch of people look at me and say like, okay, be funny, make me laugh. Like that was the worst scenario. At this point, it was like, but I had nothing left to lose. I didn’t mind. I was already like, and a friend of mine just signed me up for found a great teacher in LA and she signed us up.

[00:14:36] And like we’re doing this starts next week. And , , what was great about that is I walking into a fear of, of that. I didn’t want to do it. Like again, there was a lot of reasons I didn’t want to do it, but deep inside, I knew this was something where I was going to grow. This was going to be something that was going to be.

[00:14:54] In alignment for me somehow. And I didn’t didn’t need to know all the ways that it was. So that feeling of knowing that it was the right choice, even though I had a bunch of reasons, I had a bunch of fear of not wanting to do it. That’s what I’m talking about. And that would be a filter that I would run.

[00:15:10] The thing does working with this person feel like, does this feel right? Does this feel like someone I want to spend. Are their values, the same as mine. Are they going to help bring out the best in me? Am I going to help bring out the best in them? You know, things that, again, I might not have asked in the past , , because I was eager about the, just the end results.

[00:15:29] I was now putting through a more rigorous set of questions or, or filters. To make sure that it was truly in alignment and saying no to things was also part of that. , which there’s usually a transition. The old life is still trying to pull back like a real estate opportunity here. And it’s like, no, like that’s, I’m not a real estate guy.

[00:15:47] Like that’s not, I, you know, I had to, I had to own up that I was doing that cause my dad was into. Right. I was still trying to impress him. And that was one of the biggest moments for me ever is talking to him. And I had to tell him like, Hey there, these homes away, like this is going away. And I was expecting like, see, I told you, you shouldn’t have quit your job.

[00:16:06] You should have been doing. Like, I was just waiting for the barrage of, you know, feeling like I was not as, and he, he was like, what do you need? I’m here like a hundred percent. Yes. You know, and I was like, like, that blew me away because that is not the story I was telling of who my dad was to me.

[00:16:25] Zach White: [00:16:25] Yeah.

[00:16:26] That’s powerful, man. I, I can’t describe in words what it means to be put into a situation like that, especially with a parent, a father, such a precious and irreplaceable relationship. But anytime in your life that you’re expecting someone to respond in a way that matches the identity I hold of myself.

[00:16:52] And then they show up in that moment and they hold me in higher regard to a higher standard. And they believe in me more than I believe even myself. Wow. I mean, just. It’s such a gift.

[00:17:06] Jeff Baietto: [00:17:06] We all need that. That’s like, that’s the role of a coach, right? Like that’s why coaching is so powerful is because if you can be with someone in their space and they hold the vision of who you really are, you know, until, until we can own it for ourselves, like that’s the greatest gift.

[00:17:20] And in this case, I was just very fortunate that my dad was, is who is, is who he is

[00:17:25] Zach White: [00:17:25] to show up that way. Yeah. So Jeff, you mentioned stand-up comedy and I can imagine most career success for engineers. Would be in the same boat that that’s among the most terrifying things you could possibly imagine doing and walking into a fear, you know, awake, go the Oasis of courage.

[00:17:44] We talk about fear a lot here, and it’s easy for me to say, well, Jeff, you went through a crisis, you lost everything. You had nothing to lose. So for you to do something. You were afraid of was easy because, you know, you had this circstance that made it easy. , how would you respond to that statement?

[00:18:05] Like, oh, that’s easy for you to say.

[00:18:08] Jeff Baietto: [00:18:08] Yeah. You know, I think the big deal. , realizing what’s actually important to all of us. And what I mean by that is we don’t want comfort. We don’t want easy, like nobody does. We all think we do. , and for me that was like my sole goal. I wanted to make enough money to retire early.

[00:18:23] So I didn’t have to do things I didn’t want to do. I don’t want to do it exactly what I wanted to do all day long. And, and I took the, I took several years in my early thirties thinking I was on that path and I was not happy. And what I realized. I was actually hiking , , with some friends and , , Mount Whitney.

[00:18:40] And I realized like, why do I enjoy this so much? This is hard. I’ve got 60 pounds on my back. We’re walking for 12 hours a day uphill. Like, why is this so much fun? And what I realized in that moment is we don’t have, I don’t actually want to easy. I want the challenge I want, because getting up to the smit.

[00:19:00] We talk about it. Like that was years ago, we still talk about it. It’s an incredible memory of something that bonded with that group of people. So understanding that walking into fears, we all want to, because it’s something that’s limiting us from who we fully more fully are. And that’s like the greatest gift.

[00:19:17] When, when I did that, I was 12 weeks of practicing to get three minutes of material. That is not, that’s not very good. So like, again, that wasn’t like people in my class, they had eight minutes, nine minutes. I had three. Minutes. And I was terrified, terrified to a crowd of people who were only friends and family.

[00:19:37] Right. And so the point of this was though doing it because at the end of the day, for three minutes, I was, you know, potentially could fail horribly. Maybe it went okay, but I did it and it felt awesome. And I’ve told this story a million times and I’m most proud of that. And I think that’s what we all feel.

[00:19:54] We all know that on the right, on the other side of doing it, whether it went great or went horribly, the fact that we did it says something about us, that we all want to be able to say that I won against that. And so it’s not easy. It’s not easy. It’s not, it’s never easy. And your situation may be harder in certain ways, maybe easier in certain ways, but when you do it, and I know all of you have walked through something , , the other side, where there went greater knots, the fact that you could say you did it, that you hold onto it, we all hold onto.

[00:20:24] Yeah.

[00:20:24] Zach White: [00:20:24] Yes. I got to repeat this because it’s so important. What you said, we don’t want. That statement does not as an aid for a lot of people. Jeff, and, and I just want to hammer home the truth of what you’re saying. That there’s a part of us consciously that says, what do you mean? Of course I do. Of course I want comfort.

[00:20:46] I love going to the Caribbean and sitting on a beach or sitting in a Hawaii sipping my ties. Of course I want comfort. And maybe we associate with creature comforts or this idea of, of luxury in our life. But, but the reality. Now w what you really at below the surface desire is not a comfortable life.

[00:21:09] It’s a life of moving through those fears and those challenges and those struggles that are worth struggling well for, and that’s where you found the purpose and the meaning. So where did all of that lead to Jeff.

[00:21:24] Jeff Baietto: [00:21:24] Yeah. And I was just the button on that for me is what we all really want is. Like, that’s what we really want.

[00:21:30] I have a six year old. And if anyone has kids like growth, is it it’s, what’s so joyful to watch. My son’s name is Bodhi to watch him do something new for the first time or his third time. And him start to learn and get better at it and watch the joy in his eyes as he starts to learn something. And as he is watching himself grow at some point.

[00:21:52] Again, the pain of growth and the hiliation of not doing it well or feeling like we have a, we have, like, we get into these we’re taught. I mean, actually in school, you got to have 90% or above, you only have one chance to do this. You and it’s all these cues to say, well, don’t risk. Don’t take any risks.

[00:22:11] Know for engineers, we worked with NASA Marshall space flight center. Like these are the. Like we worked with their engineers, that these guys are awesome. Their top engineers said we’ve got a huge problem with our engineers. And it’s because our lo our motto is failure’s not an option. Do you know how hard that is to hear as an engineer, who’s supposed to break stuff and make new things.

[00:22:34] Failure’s not an option. Like that’s how we learn. Like you learn by doing and iterating and changing and doing things and all of a sudden, like your entire mantra and what you’re, you’re told over and over. Well, they meant it in one way, but it was permeating the entire class. And I think a lot of us, whether, you know, you work as we live by, failure’s not an option, but it needs to be, you know, it’s just part of the process, all this circle, like everyone who’s failed.

[00:22:58] It’s like right out of that failure. I think what you’re saying is like what your question was, what happened out of that? Well, what happened out of that is my life got better on every level. And I made changes in , , in my personal world that led to, you know, Being open to marrying, you know, getting married, like versus this idea that I was just wanting to be single.

[00:23:21] And I was this guy and whatever, like, is that what I really wanted? No. And then for my career, what did I really want? Well, I was afraid of starting a new business because, you know, I just have this failure with the, but that’s why I really wanted, like my mark on the world was to do this and why not try it.

[00:23:37] And so what if it didn’t work like the, so what was the big deal is? So what, so, so what a potential. Yeah.

[00:23:46] Zach White: [00:23:46] So what and failure is not an option is such a common mantra. Yeah. And this is a really powerful shift for, you know, the engineer listening, the amount of energy and the amount of cultural conditioning that gets spent into that belief system.

[00:24:04] And how much of an anchor that creates and resistance to doing what’s ultimately going to make you. Truly happy and fulfilled. I mean, listen to Jeff’s wisdom here and not just pulling this out of nowhere, working with some of the top engineers on the planet who are in this, in this world. And I know you’ve worked with hundreds of coaches and other people as well on this, in this space.

[00:24:23] So bring us to now, Jeff you’re here, you started enjoy global. And one of the amazing things among many that I’ve had the pleasure of even being a part of, with what you’re doing there involves taking all of the truths and the psychology and the, the proven parts of our mind in what you’ve talked about these last 20 minutes or so, and brought it into a really actionable platform and system.

[00:24:53] This idea of gamification and rolling it up into challenges. Tell me a little bit about the journey from all of this learning to the discovery point. Like when did you find that challenges were a unique and powerful way to multiply the impact of this? Yeah.

[00:25:11] Jeff Baietto: [00:25:11] Thank you. You know, in our master’s program, we would do 30 day challenges and it was about on these and having bite-size.

[00:25:18], components that we would work on certain areas of our life. And what was great about it was , , you know, 30 days is doable. Like it’s like anyone can commit to that length. It’s not too, it’s not too overwhelming, but you do start to see some, some impact in, in that amount of time. But the thing that did it for me , , and I don’t know if anyone’s ever had this experience, but you go to a training or you read a book or you do whatever.

[00:25:39] And you’re like, ah, this is it. Like, I totally, this, this resonates with me. I’m going to do, I’ve kind of bookshelf filled with amazing books. And if you asked me to grab any one of them and say, what are you, what are you applying from that book? I would have no idea. And because the answer is probably nothing application of the knowledge that I know I should be doing is even more painful than not having the knowledge in mind.

[00:26:02] Because every time I was like, well, I know better. Why am I not doing better challenges? And if anyone’s done a bootcamp or if they’ve done. Yeah. I mean, challenges like it’s a game like this is, this, is there software in our brain, right? Like, so this is, again, just this isn’t like, whew, this, there is a there’s programming in our brain.

[00:26:23] And in order for us to change, we have to rewrite the programming. And one of the easiest ways to do. Is through a challenge. And why? Because challenges trick the brain in a whole bunch of different ways. We use gamification because coming from the video game industry, that industry studied billions of points of data to see what keeps people playing.

[00:26:43] And they found that there’s seven elements of a game that trick our brain to want more. So if you use certain elements of a game attached to a real world activity, it still triggers the brain to want more of that. So you can turn something hard, like personal or professional development into a game or a challenge and trick your brain so that it doesn’t feel like it’s just another thing on the, on a laundry list of to-do to dues that are heavy.

[00:27:08] And it’s into this kind of more playful thing that, that I’m getting to do, or I look forward to do when you couple that with positive psychology and positive psychology, again is a growing field in psychology, but it basically studies how good we are when we’re in a positive state of mind versus a negative.

[00:27:25] Everyone knows. They know they’re more patient. They make better decisions. They’re more creative. They know they’re better, but how much better is what the science shows us. And it’s not a little bit, we are exponentially better at everything when we’re in a positive state of mind. But the cool part is working with neuroscientists.

[00:27:40] They’ve found that there are some simple exercises. That no matter where people fall on the continu, we can all learn to move ourselves into a positive state, more frequently and stay there longer with practice. So we use some of those exercises built into a template. So you automatically get the benefit of building that muscle no matter what you’re working on.

[00:27:59] And then we gamify it. So it tricks the brain even more. , so that it doesn’t feel like what you’re doing is work, but it feels like you’re playing something. And all of that together is only done to it’s only it’s designed. With the sole intention of helping us do something new today. So that in the direction of what we want , , that’s our transformation or our goal in the future, nothing changes unless we do something different.

[00:28:22] We all know that the definition of insanity and yet most of us are still doing the exact same thing. And, and I watched those pivotal in some of the prep you were sending us, like, what are those seminal moments? Each thing that, that has been good in my life comes down to a single decision. At one point where I decided to do something different and the ones that worked were the ones that I stayed with it long enough where it actually became a way of, of being for me.

[00:28:48], if I made a decision and then I quickly reverted back to how I was , , I didn’t get the benefit of that longterm

[00:28:54] Zach White: [00:28:54] decisions that you stuck with long enough. To really embed and make it permanent. And there are very likely people listening here who are programmers, you know, the engineer who’s listening right now, seeking career success for engineers, took some programming classes in college, or maybe they’re doing this everyday for a living.

[00:29:14] And I think that idea resonates, you know, rewriting the programming. But tell me Jeff, if I’m listening and I’m not really sure what you mean by that. Literal reprogramming of the brain. Is it, is it something that’s just an idea it’s figurative and is it anything can be rewritten or are there limits to this?

[00:29:36] Jeff Baietto: [00:29:36] So again, I’m not a neuroscientist, but , the phrase that I like is neurons that fire together wire together. So the more that we think induce and feel something. So that’s the other part of this programming is thought. And feeling right. Those two things combined , , which is very interesting because again, for me, I was very active and analytical in my head, but where I was disconnected was how I felt about it.

[00:30:00] So I would be saying certain things , , even writing down my goals, but I didn’t feel myself moving in the direction. I still had a feeling that I’m not going to get that, or I’m not worth that. Right. So it has to be feeling and, and the, the thought, okay, So when, but when we do that, we are wiring new neurons and creating a new neural pathway.

[00:30:22] So that’s why what’s so powerful about like gratitude, as you know, you hear that all the time, like be grateful. And it’s like, especially I would imagine, you know, sometimes it’s like, oh, that’s hokey almost, but here’s the reason is when you’re grateful for something, the feeling you have is as you’ve already received it, right.

[00:30:39] You you’ve received. So, if you’re grateful for the promotion that you don’t have yet, but you’re grateful, you know, what’s coming, you’re feeling the way that you’re wiring your brain right now is it’s mine. I already have it. And so when that happens, you start acting like the thought and the feelings start to influence our actions.

[00:30:57] So again, it does break down into a, into a formula that you can literally create and rewire anything. Unbelievable in terms of the responsibility, it’d be stoves on us. Like it’s a great gift and a ton of responsibility, because if you really know that you can’t blame anyone for anything.

[00:31:18] Zach White: [00:31:18] Say that again, that last sentence.

[00:31:21] Jeff Baietto: [00:31:21] I mean, we like, we want, we want it to be someone else’s fault. It’s like it’s way easier and natural, like us, this, that, this person, whatever. But if we really knew that we get to write our own story, get to create the programming that we want to live by. And that programming ends up creating our external world almost to the nth degree.

[00:31:43] Then it’s a hundred percent our responsibility and we can no longer blame anyone. And that’s, that’s tough to swallow for a lot of us, but that is the journey because it’s super freeing. It’s like, wait a second. That’s not work. That’s not working. I can do something about that. Right. They’re in there in lies.

[00:31:59] The rub is yes. , it’s not their fault, but you know, and the power is here, but it does take some work. It does take some practice and, and, and yet with time we get better at it and it, it moves fast.

[00:32:09] Zach White: [00:32:09] With my clients set of Waco. Jeff, you have engineers and senior leaders, people who are going after big results and seeking career success for engineers, balance in their life and everything.

[00:32:17] We talk about this exact principle. I call it radical responsibility. As soon as you catch yourself, blaming your circstances, other people, things that are unfair in the world around you to just recognize, Hey. Where am I going to step in and take full responsibility , , for the situation. And I love this, Jeff, you mentioned we can break it down to a formula and for the engineer listening, if they want to know, like what’s the first and most simple way I can start practicing this.

[00:32:46] I can apply this idea that Jeff just described. This might be really radical thinking for a lot of people. Who’ve never heard this before. Like what’s the first step they could take

[00:32:56] Jeff Baietto: [00:32:56] to put it into practice for me. Stick with me for a second on this one, because for me, and I would guess for Mo for a lot of engineers, like again, very analytical, very good right here.

[00:33:09] So what I realized was the missing link was how do I actually feel about this? And can I move into a feeling of what I want to feel right. Fulfilled connected , , on purpose , , excited about life, you know, whatever, whatever that feeling tone is. That was a big disconnect because I can say the words and a lot of people will say, well, affirmations are good or read some things, but if you don’t feel what you’re reading or what you’re saying, it’s not going to do any good.

[00:33:35] So for me, the, and I’ve used again, simple things like I have a six year old now my son is like the quickest way into feeling happy joy, like can like, that’s it it’s, it doesn’t matter how bad my day is. If I think of Bodhi that takes me there. Well, Google. Arranges my photos. And every couple of days they send me this little slide show.

[00:33:56] And most of the time it’s of him. And I watched this little thing in the morning and I’ll tell you, it’s one of the it’s 30 seconds. I watched this little video that they put together of my photos. And it’s just this little side show that they put the music and all of a sudden I feel awesome. I feel super excited.

[00:34:11] It doesn’t matter what my next meeting is or what I’m doing next. I, and this is the weirdest thing, like what’s changed. I don’t know anything different than I knew. A minute before, but I am bringing my very best self to the meeting, to the creative time that I’m doing , , or the developer time that I’m working with our team.

[00:34:31] Now that is a little, I think that’s a beautiful gift that Google does for all of us on our phones or our, you know, our apple photos, whatever. But sometimes. Whatever it is for you, people, you know, again, that idea of people do their gratitudes in the morning, whatever. But if you can get into a feeling awesome in the morning, how you feel is the key before bed and in the morning, if you can feel great, somehow, whatever it is, do it, that’s it like Val, that is a total game changer.

[00:35:00] You don’t have to learn a single thing more and you will be better at everything.

[00:35:03] Zach White: [00:35:03] That’s amazing. The engineer listening to this, you know, Zach white has a bias for action. Let’s, let’s do something with what Jeff is sharing here. This is life altering when you practice it. So find that short circuit, that quick access to feeling great, to feeling joy, to feeling powerful, to feeling confident and get there even in just 30 seconds in the morning, if you’ll do that, that sets the stage.

[00:35:32] For the kind of transformation that you’re, that you’re talking about. I love that Jeff, I want to be respectful of your time. We could go all day with the stories and the experiences that you bring. And you’ve already rocked my world with some of the ways that these things come to life and flipping the paradigm of achievement and, and getting that feeling first.

[00:35:52] But, you know, one thing I tell everybody great engineering, it’s just like great coaching in the fact that questions. And the answers follow and asking great questions in our lives is so important. So if the engineer listening to this conversation wants to be happy, wants to find fulfillment and success in these areas.

[00:36:15] What’s the best question to lead them.

[00:36:19] Jeff Baietto: [00:36:19] Yep. The best. And honestly, if you do this , , life will be different starting right now. The question. Is this, I know I’m successful when, or I know I’m successful if, and then answer it three times. So you have to ask yourself, what is it that makes me feel, or how do I know I’m successful?

[00:36:39] So you write down, I am successful if or I am successful win, and then finish that. Now you do it three times so that you can have more than one answer. Like for me, the default. Having enough money to, you know, not be restricted by anything in that, right? Like that defaulted came out, it was a financial one and that is one of mine.

[00:36:59] But then, then you start to go a little bit deeper for me. This changed everything because I could incorporate what else I really wanted for me. I wanted to feel energized in a way each day that I could give my very best, all day long with a ton of energy and very excited about it. Like energy was something I struggled with.

[00:37:18] And the third one was an outer one, which was, I wanted to help as many other people live the life of their dreams as possible. And when I, when I put those three together, and again, as you do this exercise, when you land on the things that really encapsulate what means, what it means to you, like now you have a north star.

[00:37:35] And if you just, if that’s the only question you ever ask, like everything comes through that. Does this make, does this help this? Does this help this? Does this help this? If the answer is no, you don’t do it. It says, yes, you’re in. And you’re all in because it’s totally in alignment with who and who and what you are.

[00:37:52] Zach White: [00:37:52] I know I’m successful when I know I’m successful. If answer it three times, Jeff, that’s super powerful. Thank you so much. I know people are going to be hungry to get more and more, more Jeff in their lives. I can never get enough Jeff in my life, but where can people get connected to what you’re doing and who you are?

[00:38:11], if they want to get more of this amazing.

[00:38:13] Jeff Baietto: [00:38:13] Yeah, thank you. You know, a couple of places. , our podcast enjoy success is great. We’ve got a lot of amazing people, a couple of times a week that are sharing their journeys and their insights. So InJoy success. It’s a, I N J O Y. A success and you can find it anywhere that you listen to podcasts.

[00:38:29] And if you want to connect with me , , I’m most active on LinkedIn , , just my name. , and I’ll, I’ll give you that link Zack, and if you can put notes, but yeah, that would be great. And enjoy is our company. If for whatever reason you’re interested in checking us out, please, please feel free to reach out there.

[00:38:46] Zach White: [00:38:46] Awesome. As a lover of podcasts, I can personally recommend InJoy success podcast. It is great. I listened to it and

[00:38:53] Jeff Baietto: [00:38:53] Zach’s episode is amazing as well.

[00:38:56] Zach White: [00:38:56] It was not meant to be a self plug, but I did it right there. , Jeff’s you’re an amazing host and there’s so much to learn from you and what you’re doing.

[00:39:04] And I can’t thank you enough for the time to be here today and what you’ve given to the engineer listening. So, Jeff, thanks for being here.

[00:39:11] Jeff Baietto: [00:39:11] Thanks so much for having me. This was a blast, I really appreciate it.